Writer-Director Mike Leigh Talks about His New Indie Gem, 'Hard Truths'

In Hard Truths, we may never know for sure why Pansy, the film’s belligerent protagonist, has such a large chip on her shoulder. And that’s because inveterate writer-director Mike Leigh would rather drop subtle motivational hints than bludgeon us over the head with exposition. True, we know Pansy - played with vitriolic zeal by Marianne Jean-Baptiste, wrestles with grief over losing her mom five years ago. She also harbors resentment over once being forced to help raise her younger sister Chantelle (Michele Austin)—now a cheerfully well-adjusted hairdresser and mother of two. 

We also know Pansy is terrified by flora and fauna of all ilk for reasons unknown. But none of these grievances justify the constant barrage of verbal hand grenades she lobs toward anyone unlucky enough to cross her path—including store clerks, dental hygienists—even an innocent man patiently waiting for Pansy to vacate her parking spot is her unsuspecting target. But no one suffers the fallout of Pansy’s malcontent quite like her immediate family. Is it any wonder her doe-eyed hubby Curtley (David Webber) hardly utters a word? Is it any surprise her grossly overweight grown son Moses (Tuwaine Barrett) is unemployable? If everything they do or say is fodder for ridicule, paralysis is their natural path of least resistance.

Seven-time Academy-award nominee Leigh, known for coaxing hyper-realistic performances from his actors through months-long collaborative rehearsal processes, spoke to Script Magazine about bringing emotional truth to Hard Truths.

This interview has been edited for space and clarity.

ANDREW BLOOMENTHAL: Several key scenes were filmed in Chantelle’s hair salon. But how did you calculate the choice to have Pansy get her hair done at her home, rather than the salon? Was it to show that Pansy’s unwilling to meet her sister on her terms?

MIKE LEIGH: With all due respect, that’s simply because her sister’s a hairdresser. Chantelle would have been doing Pansy’s hair for years because she’s family, so Pansy’s not going to go to a salon when the tradition is for Chantalle to come to her. But you may also be right - Pansy wouldn’t want to go and sit with other people. But that’s not the primary reason she doesn’t go into the salon.

BLOOMENTHAL: At a recent Q&A, you debunked the mythology that your films are completely improvised, when in fact, scenes are carefully workshopped and developed throughout rehearsals before the script is written. During rehearsal sessions, are you voyeuristically watching the actors from a distance? Or are you physically in their space, giving them notes like, 'If you face each other this way, that suggests intimacy.'

LEIGH: I’m on the outside, watching from a distance. But we first create the characters and explore their relationships through discussions, and then we build them up through improvisation, which goes on for a long stretch before shooting. In this film, rehearsal was fourteen weeks for a six-week shoot, which is shorter than usual for both phases. And during rehearsals, the actors are under instruction not to try and do anything the characters wouldn’t do. They’re told not to try and be interesting, or to have an overview, or any of that. 

When I invite an actor to take part in the project, I say: “You will never know anything except what your character knows,” so that it’s very truthful. And when those improvisations are happening, my job is to shut up and listen and watch. The input I do have - which is plenty, is doled out when they’re not in character. But you asked: “Do I tell the actors to face this way or that way?” That comes later, when we’re on location and we’re building the film, scene by scene, sequence by sequence. We send the crew away and block the scene, then the crew comes back and we shoot. 

And this is where I actually construct the action that includes not only what people say but where they are and their physical dynamics. So in the end, yes—I do say, “It would be better if you were there,” and that’s not a superficial intervention, it’s about taking the organic raw material and making sure it works aesthetically and dramatically and cinematically.

BLOOMENTHAL: I’d like to call out the scene with the lunch at Chantelle’s place, where there were a lot of characters having overlapping conversations, plus lots of action with people serving food and passing out the plates. Is it a challenge to write and direct such abundant activity? And do the actors have to match their dialogue and action the same way every take so you have editing continuity?

LEIGH: They absolutely do have to say everything the same each time, in terms of saying the same words while doing the same actions. It’s not hard to do but it is time-consuming. I don’t know if you remember, in Secrets & Lies, but there’s a barbecue scene outside before the shit hits the fan and they find out who the guest is and all that. In that scene, there are eight or nine characters sitting around and there’s a barbecue and food and stuff being talked about and misunderstood, and it took us days to build all of that. 

And similarly, the scene you’re talking about took time, but there’s a certain freedom [with the dialogue] because actors can control lines, but you can’t control a lump of meat. These things have got their own motivations. So, yes, when the characters’ conversations overlap and they’re all talking at the same time, that’s a deliberate scripted decision, but you can only arrive at that through completely organic improvisations in character, so what the actors are doing is rock solid.

BLOOMENTHAL: I know that you’re reluctant to divulge your personal opinion about what lies ahead for Pansy after the film ends, so I won’t ask you if she’ll find peace or if she’ll continue to spin out further.

LEIGH: [laughs] Good, because you wouldn’t get an answer.

BLOOMENTHAL: But that doesn’t mean I won’t challenge you with other disclosures. For example, when Pansy told Chantelle that her son Moses “never stood a chance,” in my analysis, Pansy is acknowledging how her behavior affects other people, suggesting her capacity for self-awareness. Is that what you had in mind with that line of dialogue?

LEIGH: I would not disagree with what you just said.

BLOOMENTHAL: Any elaboration?

LEIGH: It needs no more elaboration.

BLOOMENTHAL: Fair enough. But it’s great that she wasn’t one note. She was complex.

LEIGH: I’m glad you say that because that really was the whole point of the operation.

BLOOMENTHAL: Which brings me to the next question. I know that Marianne Jean-Baptiste is not a method actor, which would have made it taxing for her to carry the weight of playing such a depressed character.

LEIGH: There are actors that do that, including some distinguished actors who’ve made a habit of it. But I still think it’s unhealthy for an actor to go into character and make a thing of holding on to it in order to keep that character accessible. But in my way of working, we’re very strict and disciplined about the actors warming up into character, then being in character to shoot the scene, and then coming out of character. 

So when the first assistant director says we’re about to go for a take, everybody knows not to stand next to the actors and discuss their wives and football and whatever else. The actors warm up, then there’ll be a pause then finally I’ll say, “Action!” and when it’s over, the actor can come out of character in a safe environment. 

But apart from that, if Marianne Jean-Baptiste stayed in character as Pansy the whole time, it would be impossible to build scenes because if I told her how to do something, as Pansy she’d say, “Why?! I don’t agree with that!” because she’s being Pansy. I don’t want to deal with Pansy. I want to deal with Marianne - a delightful person with a great sense of humor who’s extremely nice and never gives us any bullshit, so we can negotiate and build a scene.

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BLOOMENTHAL: So at the tail end of a particularly emotional take, did you ever do a mental health check to make sure Marianne was OK enough to do another take?

LEIGH: No, not at all, because it’s not necessary. Our shoots are very relaxed and focused. And compared with a lot of films—most films, I would suggest, we don’t go for a lot of takes. There aren’t takes that stop because the actor says, “I’m sorry, I don’t know what I’m supposed to say,” or “I don’t feel right,” or “Can we start again?” None of that stuff goes on because the actors are focused and comfortable—however painful what’s happening to the character in the scene may be. But sometimes—quite often, in fact, we’ll do a take and I’ll say, “Cut! Let’s do it again,” and the actors will say “Why? That was great!” And the reason is because I’m looking for subtle behavioral nuances so I can take richer material into the editing room. But I’m never doing more takes to bail out a series of disasters and wrecks.

BLOOMENTHAL: And when you speak of nuances, I want to particularly call out the way Pansy cuts the wrapper off the flower bouquet with one hand, as if she’s mitigating her exposure to it. Did you direct her to do it like that?

LEIGH: No, I didn’t need to because, by that time, it was well embedded for the character - and indeed for the audience, because you already know she’s paranoid about plants and animals. To tell you the absolute truth, I don’t think we even discussed it. That’s just how [Pansy] would naturally do it because she hates flowers. She’s paranoid about them. It’s like they’re going to jump up and bite her and give her a disease because she thinks they’re filthy.

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BLOOMENTHAL: And at the screening, the audience gasped twice regarding that flower bouquet - once when her husband threw them out in the yard, and again at the Q&A afterward when you divulged that he did it as an act of love because it was a protective impulse.

LEIGH: Well to be honest with you, I didn’t say that. Somebody else said. But I didn’t say that. I don’t even know that I think it. It was attributed to somebody else.

BLOOMENTHAL: I’ll stand corrected.

LEIGH: In fact, I would never have thought of that as an explanation.

BLOOMENTHAL: Maybe I got my signals crossed. But here I have you right in front of me. So I’ll ask you to your face: What was Curtley’s rationale for throwing the flowers into the yard?

LEIGH: Not for me to discuss. That’s for you to ponder.

BLOOMENTHAL: Hey, I had to try.

LEIGH: Absolutely.

Reporters note: Mike Leigh was correct when he said he didn’t divulge the reason Curtley threw Pansy’s flowers into the yard. That theory was suggested by the Q&A moderator: Moonlight director Barry Jenkins.